Discuss Christianity, Preaching & Christian Related Issues or HappeningsDiscuss christianity, preaching, practical living issues, ethics or morality, challenges, being a christian, christian related happenings .. [Post Christian Forum].
Is God against rich people? or God against those who are slave to money?
one can be rich but generous and after the things of God(Biblical example: NT: Peter, Luke, Paul; OT: Abraham )
one can be poor and still be slave to money (whole day only think of making more money, focus on money, money, money)
Oh.... if you still think that proverty is good, and pursuit of wealth is bad....
1) give me all you money, I will scarifice myself for your sake
2) please tell your boss not to give you any raise, its bad for you.
ok, joke aside, no one want to be poor, no one like to be sick
alot of people who say the similar of the above about preaching health & wealth also pray for promotions. pay increment, healing, protection....etc both for themselves, and those they love, so are these also chasing after health and wealth? if so, why not do it openly, rather than hid one corner in the dark?
the only way to verify any teaching, is to verify if this was taught in the Scriptures. If God promised this and its in the Bible, that you can be sure of it. Then preaching such promises will be alright. And try to read things in context. the few verses that was quoted (Matthew 19:24 and Luke 18:25, Matthew 6:19-21, Philippains 3:18-19) are against people who are slave to money and those who seek only the things of the earth, not those who are rich nor those with earthly procession.
Vince quite clearly you are missing my point. I stated very clearly in my posts that I have nothing against rich people nor am I in anyway insinuating that you have to be poor to gain God's favour. This is an arguement that megachurch christians always use to justify their pastors disgustingly rich lifestyle.
Is staying in a hdb flat or driving a toyota very poor? If so, then myself and a hundreds and thousands of Singaporeans are considered poor.
What I am aghast is how pastors like hinn can pursue riches so blatantly to the point of using God's name to do it. Its fact that these pastors are leading millionaire lifestyles at the expense of the poor and needy. They do not have the slightest bit of humility in them.
Say what!! if you believe this, you will believe anything....
Maybe not, but the pope will beat the two of them together hands down, what with the vatican and all it's glory...and support from the mafia maybe...
Sure, like I said, they have the mafia and bunch of clowns like them behind them.
Anyway, having said all that Mr charisma, my sentiments on city harvest and new creation are not much different from yours, to me they have somewhat lost the plot, no matter how much good they intend. But then again, the Catholic church lost the plot long long time ago, way way before them with their paganistic teachings. So look before you leap Mr. charisma
You could say the same about the anglicans and methodists too. My arguement is with commercialised megachurches and its practices. Do you see denominational churches changing the face of christianity like these megachurches do? We have traditions and are rich in culture and history.
What do these non-denominational megachurches have? Where do their pastors get their doctrines from? Themselves or God?
Who are they to proclaim themselves as God's annointed and suddenly decide to start a church ?
Are they futhering their own self centered perception of christianity?
Aren't they causing christianity to be even further divided than it already is?
HE is one of the most well-known televangelists in the US, but also one of the most controversial.
And his engagement to speak at City Harvest Church's (CHC) first Asia Conference in Singapore has stirred strong reactions among netizens.
Best-known for his 'miracle crusades' - large revival and 'healing' summits in large stadiums in major cities - Reverend Benny Hinn is one of the most high-profile healing evangelists in the US.
However, investigative news reports by syndicated news programmes, including Inside Edition and Dateline NBC, have questioned some of Rev Hinn's claims, including those that say he has the God-given gift of healing people who attend his crusades.
The reports also revealed documents which alleged that Rev Hinn lived the high life while on his missions - enjoying luxurious getaways in presidential suites, dining at expensive restaurants and jetsetting in a private plane.
In 2005, Ministry Watch, an independent evangelical organisation which reviews Christian ministries for financial transparency, issued an alert to donors stating that 'the reported exorbitant spending of the Hinn family reveals that Benny Hinn Ministries has far more money than it needs to carry out its ministry'.
Singapore blogger Lim Yee Hung questioned CHC's decision to invite Rev Hinn as a guest speaker at its conference.
He wrote in his blog: 'This man obviously has a reputation, and it will be hard to believe that City Harvest is oblivious to this.
'So, given the (very plausible) assumption that CHC is aware of the man's past, the question is, why did it invite him to its conference, and make him the star attraction?'
Responding to Mr Lim's blog post, netizen Xizor2000 wrote: 'I do hope that people realise that popular pastors are not necessarily 'right'.'
Another netizen, Terence, wrote: 'Given the overwhelming evidence against speakers like Benny Hinn, why is CHC continuing to give him a stage and a mike to preach?'
In an e-mail response to The New Paper's queries, a CHC spokesman said: 'Rev Benny Hinn is a well-known minister, having spent more than 30 years as a full-time pastor and Christian worker.
'He is a sought-after speaker all around the world and is still being invited to speak in many major international conferences.'
The spokesman added that the church is aware of the online buzz about Rev Hinn's ministry, 'some negative and some positive'.
'But as it is with any other successful ministry, one can expect both bouquets and brickbats for their work,' he said.
At his crusades, Rev Hinn claimed to have healed people of a variety of afflictions, including deafness, cancer and even Aids.
But a 2006 CBC Television special, Do You Believe In Miracles, showed footage of seriously disabled attendees at Rev Hinn's crusades being interviewed and stopped from going on stage to be healed.
Instead, those with conditions impossible to detect superficially were taken on stage.
Responding to Mr Lim's post, an anonymous poster who claimed to be a member of the church wrote: 'Yes, criticisms may be rife about him (Rev Hinn), but it is important that you don't come to judgement so quickly, especially when your information sources are biased.'
Netizen Lance Chew said in an ongoing discussion thread on Tomorrow.sg: 'If Benny Hinn really were misusing the people's money, why hasn't he been nailed?
'All you can see are soft protests like TV programmes...
'It is really wrong to bring down the entire church, the pastoral board and the annual conference event (which potentially could save many souls) just because of a speaker.'
The New Paper contacted Benny Hinn Ministries for an interview with Rev Hinn.
Mr Louie Vasiliou, a spokesman for Benny Hinn Ministries Australia, said Rev Hinn was not available for media interviews because of a 'hectic schedule'.
A favorite term in the Word of Faith movement is "positive confession." It refers to the teaching that words have creative power. What you say, Word of Faith teachers claim, determines everything that happens to you. Your confessions, especially the favors you demand of God, must all be stated positively and without wavering. Then God is required to answer (as though man could require anything of God!). Thus God's ability to bless us supposedly hangs on our faith. James 4:13-16 clearly contradicts this teaching, "Come now, you who say, Today or tomorrow we will go to such and such a city, and spend a year there and engage in business and make a profit. Yet you do not know what your life will be like tomorrow. You are just a vapor that appears for a little while and then vanishes away. Instead, you ought to say, If the Lord wills, we will live and also do this or that. But as it is, you boast in your arrogance; all such boasting is evil."
Romans 10: 8-10; "But what saith it? The Word is night thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: That is, the Word of faith, which we preach; That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus [Jesus is The WORD, this Bible-John 1:1],and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved." For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation."
The same said in 2Corinth. 4:13; "We having the same spirit of faith, according as it is written, I believed, and therefore have I spoken; we also believe, and therefore speak;"
What is confession? True confession is saying what the WORD said, not what the priests or what the church organizations said;when you are confessing with thy mouth the Lord Jesus Christ which is The WORD, you are saying what the Scriptures said. That's a true confession. And that Word of Faith should be night thee, mean always you must said what the Word said.
In 2 Corinth. 10: 5;"Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and beinging into captivity every though to the obedience of Christ."
Remember, Christ is The WORD, the Bible; this Scriptures here said we must throw away reasoning (imaginations) and all the men's carnal intellectual conceptions that contradict the Spirit of Jesus Christ (The WORD), you must bring yourself, your own mind into subjection (obedience)to the WORD of God. When you deny the WORD, you are denying Jesus Christ.
Now, we know throughout the scriptures, the Bible taught us that every things you receive must be by faith, or through faith, whatever, all is according to your faith. Read the whole book of Hebrews you'll see what it mean.
Heb. 4: 14; "Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession. (what you confess is what yours) For we have not an high priest which cannot be toughed with the feeling of our infiemities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin."
Also in Heb.: 25; "Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them."
When you're sick, you read from the Scriptures that God promised in Isaiah 53: 5, "and with his stripes we are healed." you believe from the heart it's true Word's of God, and confess it with your mouth that God said is true.Then God, the Spirit of Jesus Christ which is the High Priest, will then base on this genuine confession of faith on Him the WORD, start to make intercession for you to made God's promise come to pass as you have believe.
God is not obilgated to what any men or priests, or church's doctrain said, God is only obligated to HIS Own WORDS, THE BIBLE. You believed God's Word, you confess what God said is true, then God is going to perform according to your faith that is in Him His Words, not what others had said.
Brother, when you discard the Words of God and base your salvation on the chruch you join, you'll be lost, and that's truth. You have to come back to this Words of God, which is the Bible, then God can deal with you. Any man comes to think that this Words is not infallible, but the church, or some priests said, you are deceived.
Jesus counts character, not members. You know that? He counts characters. God has always tried to get one man in His hand. That's all He needs is one man, and he'll do His work. Through the years just think: He could only find one rightrous man in the time of Noah. In the time of Moses He only found one righteous man.
Look at Samson. See, God can only use what you surrender to Him. Samson was a big strong man; he had a lot of strenght. Samson surrendered his strenght to God, but he wouldn't give his heart. He give his heart to Delilah. See? And that's the way with the people today. Oh, brother, they'll reach down and pay off debts, and things like that, and build a bigger denomination, and so forth like that, but when it comes to giving their heart, they won't do it. That's right.
Peter had a sword. He pulled that sword was going to cut the high priest's ear off, and things like that; he did it. But when it come to real Christian courage, he didn't have it. He backed up and denied Him. Is that right? He could cut the high priest's ear off with his sword, sure, he knowed how to handle it. But when it come to the squeeze and time to stand on the Word of God, he didn't have the courage, and even denied he knowed Jesus.
That's where it is today. We got courage to build buildings and put millions of dollars in them. We got courage to put pipe organs, and plush seats, and everything, and go out and proselyte from place to place, and make the Methodists come Baptists, and so forth, back and forth like that.
But when it come to Christian courage to accept the Word and the message of God, and stand there on it, we are few.
William Branham--End time Evangelism. June 1962.
Last edited by eagle; 23rd October 2008 at 09:02 PM..